Mark Burik (00:01.272)
Hey everybody. And welcome to this edition of better at beach podcast. My name is Mark Burke. And today we are in our coach Academy live meeting. So if you don't know, we have the complete coach Academy on better at beach.com and we bring in different guests each week. So what you guys will get to hear is our full interview today with John Drake, who is the manager and operator of
ran sans volleyball in Loveland, Ohio, super successful indoor facility. And with our coaches Academy, a lot of times we do talk volleyball technique, coaching, training, and all those philosophies. But we also talk a lot about business management, how to run a team, how to run a club, maybe how to hire coaches, train staff. And so today we get to talk to John Drake, who has gone through all of that. He is.
former open player was an AVP player and now he's slid into the upper echelon of the volleyball world where he is running one of the best facilities, if not the best facility in Ohio. So.
That's what we're talking about today. Our members get to do a live Q and a with him. So if you want to become a part of the complete coach Academy, all you do is go to better beach.com forward slash coach. You're going to get all of our courses, all of our strategy. You're going to get all of our practice plans and you get one live meeting a week and every other week. And other week. That's when we just bring in somebody who we want to interview, who we think is going to be a great talk and a great feature.
That's what we're today John is there like a an AC going on in the background? No, some kind yeah, if I hear all mine I just want to make sure that guys guests if you can please mute everything that you have that would be great
Mark Burik (02:08.558)
All right, that helped it. right, so let's get into it. Absolutely. Thanks for the very nice words as well. You had to say, and obviously we love having you guys out every year. It's been a few years now. You're coming out and everyone loves your group and everything like that. it's, yeah, it's very nice. And you're correct. I spent my earlier young career years playing as what I could do. And then finally, when this was kind of handed to me,
from the previous owners and general managers of running grandstands. just kind of just made sense. I it was going to cut back on my actual playing time, I love it. I mean, it's a fun job. It's a fun gig to do and everything. And I love just people. There's thousands of people that are there I see on a weekly basis and it's good adjustment. I like it. That's great. Let's talk first about a little bit of your playing career.
Okay. and then, I want to get into the business management. So you were actually, which is crazy because you were a competitor of mine. And then you also came out to the original better at beach, which is volleyball camp for Moses. So we did, a week, if not two weeks of training out here, but you ended up with, a pretty unique style with your partner, Chris Lures. would say that the way you guys.
played volleyball was significantly different in its structure than most of the other ABP teams. And I remember lower passes, lower sets, almost like you were kind of running like a one and a half or a middle quick type offense on a lot of sets. And I just want to know if that was a choice you made, why you made that choice and how you were able to get so much success.
with your partner and running your own system. Yeah. I feel like maybe some teams, kind of just underestimated us cause it's, I don't play with a guy who looks like he's 60 years old or whatever. I mean, Chris was, I mean, he's just a, a guru. Like, I mean, he, I had a handful of people teach me how to Volleyball. taught me how to play beach volleyball and it was, and I'm a grand at lot of stuff. I really don't know what he was doing. He would just say, Hey,
Mark Burik (04:34.094)
Go block this ball, reach, make him shoot as high as possible for the high line. I say, okay. And I'll be, they would do that. And I turn around and he was there. Like he would just run plays and I was just kind of his puppet, but not it works. You know, he was just, and he, he loved that. Yeah. Like that quick one to two ball set. and I think it just helped his vision, seeing the lower sets, you know, he has, and plus it doesn't give the defender a lot of time to, figure out what they're going to do. That's that comes out and boom, they already have to almost be moving to kind of get what they needed to go. but,
Yeah, so that that type of offense and it was in. funny, cause even still like I don't think really anybody does it or I don't really really seen anybody kind of run that type of a court drop it like consistently every single every single time. And I will say that that would be one of our biggest disadvantages was where we're at in grandstands were in the limit of the valley and so a windy day comes once a month kind of thing. So we don't get that practice. So you typically when we go out, I remember that very first year we went out to volleyball camp.
There was one day where it was just like, didn't want to practice because it was just, I was not like, just felt just, cause of, you know, all different. So that was like our biggest downfall. We got off the beach and our class of one, there's a huge factor in how we can run our offense. Because now all of sudden, the lower passes do help, but that it just, it's just tougher. so there was a, our biggest accomplishment was when the FIVB was out in Huntington, was like 2018.
2019 something like that we be qualified for that event as well, which that was like That was a close moment between our partnership because he was just a kid in a candy story So that was a bucket list thing that you never thought would ever check off kind of thing but the difference is that we qualified us where the water was glass like it was the calmest day ever and we were able to just Play our game all the way through we make it into the main draw and then next day
It is a very, very windy day and it looked like we never played volleyball before. It's just like that nine day difference. As long as we can play with the elements of what we're used to playing, you know, we, grew and you know, we qualified. I qualify, I don't remember. think maybe like three times, three ADPs with him. one more with Joe Ruzik and we meet him at the FIVB. So then we had a few, you know, breakthroughs where we were able to go. And then typically that was just almost in a sense, what a defendant kind of thing, you know, with the wind being a big factor with that.
Mark Burik (07:01.262)
But, no, just, he was a just, I mean, he still is, I mean, he's still competing and still beating people. And it's still so frustrating because he can just size you up. And no matter how big the blocker is, he hits that one inch over the top of those hands every time he's really, really smart player. Yeah. I would say it was, it was super impressive to see probably one of the most undersized teams in my memory, to do the damage that you guys did and to.
Run your offense, commit to it. And I do agree that lower set. lot of defenders wait for a moment in the set and they sit in the middle and then they wait for the set to go up. And then they flash to one side. I try to get my players out of doing this. Like now currently I'm just saying go directly to your spot. Do whatever jukes you want from the place where you can already dig a hard driven ball. And then they say.
Well, what happens if they go on two? And my response is on two is an attack just like on three is. So if you're not playing defense in the middle for the on three attack, why are you playing defense in the middle for the on two attack? And so, when you do run that lower offense, if you're playing against defenders who want to sit in the middle, then as that set goes up, if it's only one or two feet above, they have to respect that.
hard cross or hard line. And so they make this big, quick move. And if you don't wait, if you see that movement real quick, and I think that's what Chris Lures does really well is sees that movement and then hits the shot away from you. And I think a lot of teams struggle with the change of timing. And when you change somebody's timing defensively, you also make them easier to see because they have to make bigger, faster moves. And now they're off balance while you're hitting.
And so long as you have good vision, like the two of you guys do, you can tear teams apart on that lower set. Yeah, no, absolutely. And he's also really good. remember one of the very, I remember the very, very first open tournament I ever entered in. I played against Chris and, and, as a different partner at the time. And I'm not sure it might've been even after that tournament or shortly after I remember kind of what I'm going up to my own. And I just asked him like, how,
Mark Burik (09:26.894)
How do you get so many dicks? You know, as dumb as that sounded or whatever. Cause I was never watching them. just like, he just, I felt like he just was, and it was just literally booked. opened up and then he was just eating people up and everything. And it was a blow me away. And I can still remember this day that he does a lot of, I don't know. He just analyzes people. He analyzes probabilities. Like what does the tendency that somebody typically likes to do, what shot do they like to go with? And then he keeps track of that. Like his memory on stuff is.
pretty mind blowing of how he can recap matches from years ago and like almost a point for point all the way through. I just, I mean, I don't know what I did yesterday. of remember back in 99, we played each other. was the match after pool play. And then you hit that high line and I go.
Sounds pretty cool. Yeah, it is just one of those things to where I'm just like, I just maybe he's making lots of lucky guesses and stuff like that. But then when I kind of heard him like talk about that, and then just other things and also just do playing with him, it would be sitting there, we're walking back and I'll be going back to serve and he's like, and he'll be talking to me like, okay. And you hear him like, he's mentally talking to himself and then finally he's like, all right.
All right, I want you to do any. You give me something you know, whatever he literally does just every play. He is just thinking on what are they going to do? And I know so which granted he does do a lot of reading and stuff like that too, but he asked. They say that a lot of this game is just that tendencies, probabilities, you know what he thinks that next person is going to do and he reads stuff just so very well. And he's you know he's getting older now. He just had his 50th birthday and he just he still play this past weekends open tournament.
So when you qualify, was 43, 44, 45? Yeah, I'm trying to think the last, cause I guess we would have stopped right before like COVID shut down and everything. I to say maybe like 20, yeah, 2019 ish would have been last time about five years ago. Yeah. So even, yeah, the mid forties for sure. So yeah, but no, he's a, he's a, he's a wizard and he, he's one of those, it's like, I hate to see him not out in the sand.
Mark Burik (11:40.558)
in which I don't know how much longer he's got because he's definitely, you know, it's you can tell he struggled at the end of the matches, but at the same time, I can't wait for him to not be across the net from me. It's just so annoying to play against because it's so basic. You just can just make suck you in with that little short knuckle and then all of a sudden you shoot it up over top of your head and just makes it look just looks easy. No kind of thing, but it's just awesome. What did you think as coming from an open player?
in Ohio to then competing on the AVP. What do you think the main differences were between the athletes that you had to beat in quarters, semis and finals back home? And then now the last round of qualifiers and in the AVP, what do you think separates those levels or what's the main difference?
I would say just consistency. mean, it's a lot of times you mess up that one point and that's the point you lost by, you know, kind of thing, whether it was a double on the set or you set your partner too tight, you know, kind of thing.
those players on tour don't really like really make those errors kind of thing. And I mean, because I remember there was one man beach. Major all over in we're playing the bomb gun brothers and it was like 1717 or 1818 something like that first set and I'm thinking like, we might have a chance to take a set kind of thing. And that's the one thing is that I've qualified him full time to never even want to set.
before, it got really close and I was like the closest at that time. And, and then, and that, think what, and then like they, set it out, you know, so they're up one. I remember it was, was set point 2019, Chris gave me a pass and it just moved a little bit and I dove off and I said it and they caught a lift and that was that one, know, my thing. And it was just like, I'll just like killed me, you know, kind of thing, whatever, you know, so it's like, but ultimately, I mean, I mean, that's it, obviously everyone at that level is.
Mark Burik (13:45.486)
Super athletic, mean they jump high, they hit hard. I'm anyway, well as far as we're an undersized team for sure. I was a blocker on six three on a good day. Maybe not as much now, like shave a little bit. But that also kind of helped in a sense because I wasn't big so I was easier to hide. got jumpers, so I did lots of rising. So I got to get a lot of blocks and stuff like that. But I mean, really that's just it. Just like consistency of just being able to side out.
And just hold your own and just wait to make that play and make that diagonal play to get that one block that would feel it or you know, hope that they you know made a setting error hitting error kind of thing because I mean that was it but at the same because locally You know, we're all friends. all you know see each other We play each other all the time stuff like that Not that we're out there to try to win or whatever But a lot of times you do something where you get you know shit house or something
And it would be like, hey, good luck. know, and you're kind of high five, know the team because it's like, you know, you're always their friends, but no, I'm not pro level. It's just, it's, different. Everyone. Everything is just way more zoned in way more just tight in there. I mean, I played better at that level and stuff too. I had played a qualifier for years and I played this past Manhattan, beach open, with a local player who just moved out there to Mosa and Nicola. And I was kind of like, I mean, I'm like, I'm in no shape or.
ready to like qualify for this, but I'm like, we'll just see what happens. And it wasn't until I was out there playing where I'm like, man, I this. It's just, it's different. It's a cool feeling just being out there with all the officials, all the other team known players and stuff like that. It's a really, really neat experience to do. And something I think everyone has the option to do it, to just do that, know, sign up, you know, whatever, get out there. It's a pretty neat.
It's hard to describe what the differences of getting on that level versus just getting out of your comfort zone for one, just getting out of your own home facility traveling. yeah, it's something I kind of miss and makes me kind get that little itch like, you better try pushing again.
Mark Burik (16:04.91)
I prefer lots of training and different things, yeah, I have a little bit. yeah. When you, when you talk about errors, I just saw a post, about chase button, your stats in the last AVP league, 17 kills, zero errors. And when you look at local open level, people make three, four hitting errors just on kind of routine plays.
And you have that breathing room and it becomes easy. And I also think the patience of defense separates, AVP defenders from open level defenders where open level defenders back home in New York, where I'm from, they're like, he sees me, he sees me, he sees me. I have to move late. And then as soon as you move late, you're not moving late enough. And I see that. And then I have an easy shot kill. Whereas, you know, a
ABP defender will hold their ground and say, go ahead first. Let's see if you can hit a high line over my blocker and fast enough for me to catch up to it. You know, like, can you beat me in that race first? Okay. If you can do that three or four times in a row, then now I'm going to start showing you some jukes to see if I can get in your head and see if I can get you to lay your arm or wait till you're on your way down and give you some confusion. I just found that.
Defenders were more patient, faster. And then as soon as you start shooting, they changed their strategy. They start peeling sooner. Blockers start reaching higher instead of pressing. yeah, that was my coming from New York, like in every semi or final to that qualifier and low AVP level, just to be like, okay, they're not giving me.
any spots anymore. They're not just giving it away. Now they're sitting there and they're saying, come on, let's see if you're good enough. Yeah, I guess that's actually, I'd go off that too. Is the effort you put into every jump is as well. there's a lot of times you have, you're kind of get there and you're like, all right, I'm just going to kind of just go up and hit a high line kind of thing. But when you're there, if you don't max jump, that high line is getting spotted or that high line is, you know, getting tipped up and defenders there.
Mark Burik (18:26.926)
it up or something or the other. yeah, it's just there is no, I'm going to turn it down a little bit, have a little breather. Every point is full, full send every peel off the net for that. You know, if you're trying to peel back as a blocker, mean, you know, same thing, I might kind of get away with backing up, you know, backpedaling a little bit, you know, early res there, I got to go full down squat and just turn and go and run to be able to chase those shots down. So definitely a lot and
And then even that, and so the, to the amount of energy that you exert in at that level, going back to like the FIDB qualifier, we had, I remember we had a one match on a Wednesday. That was the USA qualifier and we won that one. so we made it to Thursday and we had to play, I feel like there was maybe one more USA team. Then we had to be a play a team from Poland and then one from Norway. It was just three matches.
And back home, like the Cinti tournaments here, I mean, we're used to playing, you know, five, six, you know, matches in a day. you know, like some might've even kind of hinted towards even seven matches. Just in that one match that Wednesday in those three matches on Thursday, but Friday rolled around. Like I was exhausted. You know, just because it just cause of that. Cause you're just everything you're adrenaline, everything was just running and pump in. And even though like some of those games even went into or even like really that one matches.
Hey, well, I was wiped out, you know, when I was going to bed, like Thursday night kind of thing. And not only, you know, you have to just put in 100 % every single point, but just, just everything, everything is just working on such a high level that it does kind of wear on you a little bit more aware. Whereas I could come here and play four or five matches. And then afterwards it's like, all right, what bar we going to? drink and stuff kind of thing. So yeah. And especially those, the pool play matches, if you've got the talent and you're already like built, like you're one of the athletes, one of the ones who is.
trained until you've become consistent, then there are teams that you just kind of can sleep through. You kind of just coast, you know, and you'll see the double A players that are just trying open for the first time and put a knock it on them. But I think. Yeah, the the fact that morning of and especially you're amped up in an AVP, right? You're I mean, you're warm up, you're like warming up harder than ever. There's.
Mark Burik (20:53.806)
200 people watching you in warmup. you're like, I'm going to bounce this and wasting a full match in between matches, which eventually that adrenaline settles down a little bit. And you realize like, okay, let me relax on this warmup and let me use it for the game. But, yeah, that when you're winning tournaments, when you get to that level, because you've trained, because you've put it in and because you've decided I'm one of the four to six athletes in my region.
That actually shows up and runs drills. You know, I'm putting in hours every day as opposed to just going and playing when you become that player. Then you start seeing that you can coast through some teams because they don't have that consistency that you've built up through getting an extra, you know, 300 high lines that week or an extra 300 passes because you actually just said, Hey, let's have received for 20 minutes.
That's right. Well, let's, we are running low on time, but what I do want to talk about is facility operations, you know, from somebody who came as a player. And then now you are in a management role in a big facility, Grand Sands, Loveland, Ohio. So how many courts indoor do you have? How many outdoor courts do you have? And do you remember how the original, the owner
acquired it and how they fitted volleyball courts into it? So it was the initial building was it was a lumberyard that they knew somebody knew actually one of the owners does live in Loveland so I believe they know he was kind of person who knew of a building they went and checked it out so square footage realized hey we could fit you know five indoor sand courts in here.
So they, so basically that's what they was three total investors that went in on purchasing the location. Kevin Westerkam, who was the general manager and part owner, he was the one who had the foresight of the vision of doing that. There was one place in Northern Kentucky that had just two indoor sand courts, so it was connected to a bowling alley.
Mark Burik (23:16.558)
You had to walk through that and lots of smoke and stuff, know, and everything. just was kind of gross, but it was just, was, there's indoor sand courts, you know, where you can drive 30, you know, 40 minutes to go get it, go to it and it worked. But that was just the vision that you saw. And it was like, Hey, I mean, it exists. So why can't we just make it bigger and better? So he found the investors who found the location, gutted it out, put it in the five indoor courts. And then we started playing through that winter.
That fall and winter and then come spring they were already working on me breaking the outside ground for five outdoor courts So then but that spring and we all moved outside. So then it was just back and forth, you know rain or shine and then it stayed at five and five or handful of years almost they made might have been like five ish or so years and then they did we just maxed out on space and we needed more so they
brought on somebody that looked at the lay of the land, mapped it all out, where we could add two more indoor courts and created a bigger bar as well. And then also it was plenty of space to add in two more outdoor courts. So we now currently have seven, seven inside, seven outside. Could go to probably 10 inside, 10 outside if we had the space for, but we're just maxed out on that right now.
You know, I have well over 100 teams and on my wait list to get in for leagues and stuff sitting on a way. Yeah, just the, just the wait list, you know, across, across the board, which we run leagues Sunday through Friday. Saturdays are for tournaments, work, you work parties, graduation parties, vomit. So I mean, literally just saying that you can think of, and, and yeah, I mean, it's, and it's, it's busy. you know, it's pretty much like, you know, nonstop all the way through. and.
We just, I mean, we redid our parking lot recently just to kind of even maximize that because we were kind of running. That was a big part of it where we would like to be able to run like all 14 courts in a way if we could, but we just don't have the parking to bring in that many people. So now we're able to add about 40 more parking spots, expanding it and just painting lines a little differently and everything like that. So now we comfortably are fitting everybody in there. And, you know, I'm trying to run all my outdoor leagues with
Mark Burik (25:36.942)
indoor courts and stuff or, know, slowly to utilize them for people when they come in for open play or different things like that. So, yeah, it's, it's, fun. I'd say that's the biggest thing. I didn't realize it. So I went with an architect and a hotelier and when I mapped out how much space that I would need to do a little math, like, okay, how much space is volleyball court take? All right. It's 26 feet by 26 feet, but really you want 30 feet by 30 feet. And then at least
10 feet on the end lines. So now you're up to 80 feet long and then probably 10 feet on each sideline is, is friendly enough. And so then you're at 80 by 50, right? And that's, that's one court. And so when I started looking at acreage and everything, the guy who I was working with, he just instantly doubled it. And I was like, Whoa, I don't need that much. He goes,
It's a business. You have to have enough parking for what your business can sustain. And so the amount of court space was the same amount of space that you needed for parking. And I was like, my God, I didn't even realize that. And so I think ATX beach in Austin, this is another one. And I think this is the way to go. And this is the way that a lot of people do is instead of building from scratch and going through all of that.
Financial strain and paying interest before you generate revenue. A lot of people find buildings where it works. and then you put that sand in there because it's, it's expensive to build a place expensive to then pave a parking lot and then do the electricity from scratch. And you're probably waiting six months to a year just to get your building set up and, all coded and everything where if you buy something that's pre-existing, okay.
Now get sand in there. Once you got sand in poles, you can start generating revenue and that can happen within two, three weeks. And so you're covering at least some of the early interest payments if you've taken a loan to do it. Yeah, I remember that. I do remember that. was when the doors, I showed up to grandstands like day one, soon as they opened up for leagues and been there ever since. And this November is going to be 15 years that we've been up and running.
Mark Burik (28:03.566)
So I started out there day one as referee, think rep two or three nights a week for a while. And then just over quite a few years later, that's when they were like, well, would you want to manage this night? Take week fees and make sure everybody shows up, all that kind of fun stuff and run the tournaments and different things. And then it just kind of slowly snowballed until finally they were like, no, we don't want to do this forever. We're ready to retire. And then it kind of like handed off to me. But I do remember that at the very beginning.
coming in and yeah, a lot of the benches and stuff like that, railings and everything like that still weren't like painted or anything. know, was just, yeah, a lot of stuff, but nobody cared. Like everyone just wanted to get in there and just get on the sand, especially during the So you don't have the chairs or the bar set up or like, you know, some paint isn't finished. So what? Like in my business, there have been so many rough drafts that we've put out and said,
go and the rough draft, putting that out into the world. It allows you to actually get more feedback and a lot of software developers and app developers, they know this, like send out your first draft, ask people what's wrong. And then you're not stuck with one or two people trying to figure out everything that's wrong. Now you've gotten all that feedback, so long as you're honest with them and you say like, Hey, this isn't our finished product. want you to help us make it great. So let us know what else you need. Of course you want to have a roadmap.
But I think it's super important to just not demand perfection from the very start because that just slows you down hardcore. And then the more you slow down, if it's a business or you've taken a loan or you're paying for rent or mortgage, you're trying to be perfect while your bank account is getting empty. know, instead of, okay, we got a fours league. Yeah, we got no chairs. Yeah, okay, we got no ball nets. But you guys can play volleyball. Great.
Yeah, no for sure. it's also go off your point. There is. This nice sand volleyball. They are a another currently an outdoor facility that was coming one of the main places that people played quite a years ago for all open tournaments and different things and so I very first ever started playing sand volleyball as well and they are in the building process of just moving a little bit. mean, they're only 15 minutes away or so from from grandstands.
Mark Burik (30:30.862)
And they are moving from that location and are building a seven indoor seven outdoor facility from ground up. And our department is like, I can't wait for it to happen just so I can help push off. Quite a few teams I have, know, taxing me month after month of month. When are we going to get in? When are we going get in kind of thing, whatever. Because, you know, but it'd be nice for that to be be done. But they have been just running into those building permit issues and coatings and different things like that. And they were
I'm not really sure actually where what the current progress is very now that is quite a few months behind and I mean, granted, it's one of those like they still have their outdoor facility, they had to reopen it back up and are running leaks there and stuff while they are behind on the building process for it. But from that, even from Kevin talking about even just grandstands in general, there were some hiccups that where they ran into that some little things that they didn't think about, you know, that
they were hit with, you know, even from even from the expansion of the second part of the building, different things that they had to account for and pay for to get put in that they weren't didn't know. mean, some were some pretty large ticket items. So it is massively faster and easier if you do have an existing location where you can just go in and just, you know, renovate it, make it the way you need it to be rather than start from from square one. But the nice thing is, though, if you can start from square one, it's.
what you want it to be. So there are some things with Crayons hands where we wish that their beams weren't in certain spots over the top of the courts or whatever. It'd be a lot nicer if had a little more space for things like that or the layout to be a little bit nicer. But the main place, people love it. get a lot of people coming in from out of town. I think we even had somebody from California come in this past weekend. We have guys from almost all of our open tournaments. have people from, bunch of people came out for missions.
again, Indianapolis, Atlanta. It's pretty cool just to at the crowds, know, Spice even though might not be the most perfect facility, it's still a great facility. And, you know, just the competition that we have around it is also a big thing that draws people in. Yeah. the thing is, so my theory on this and belief is that if you're going to start a sand facility, you need enough courts to where you can build a community.
Mark Burik (32:50.796)
And if you have two courts, to me, that's like a hobby. or if you're just running an exclusive coaching program and something like Florida or California, where there are enough beach players who just want private lessons or a small club. Okay. That's one way. But if you don't have enough courts, people can't just go to the facility and hang out. Right. It's like, no, those two courts are going to be taken and it's not my level. And even when they do walk in like a beginner.
walks in and they see all the high level players and they'll never come back because they go, there's no one there that's my level. But when you see seven, 14 courts, you start counting and you're like, there's somebody like me, there's somebody like me. And plus you're hanging out because there might be 40, 50, a hundred people there. And if you're young and single or you're just social, like there's enough people there for you to make friends with and just spend time there so that you can, for the business at least.
maybe make some extra money on the beer and alcohol sales or the food sales and anything like that. Into my next question. do believe that you need minimum four courts to really build something strong. that's, that's what I think. And when I built my facility, that's, we're going to aim at minimum at that, but how much, I don't know how much you're hardcore into your books, but
If you could give a percentage on how much of a percentage of your revenue comes from birthday parties and corporate events, just beer sales, just food sales, and then leagues. And I imagine most of your leagues are fours and sixes. They are. Yeah. We did have, we did have a decent amount of a two's leagues across the board, but they've just kind of slowly dwindled out. And then from a business perspective, I was like, well,
I don't really want to kind of push to try to get more teams to take up space. So I kind of let them just fade out and now, know, fill them with more fours and sixes. And, and yeah, and that's been for the most part across like the board. I'm really almost like every night there's almost all of the offerings on all of our nights and other, know, we have our men's leagues, men's fours, the co-ed fours, the co-ed sixes. We do have some women's doubles, men's doubles, you know, so we do.
Mark Burik (35:11.566)
They're pretty good variety of everything offered across the board. I I'm not the person who does all the books, but I can we say that I know what drives and everything comes from the top and bottom would be the top would just be all of our leafies and everything that we're getting from all of the all of the teams. That's the biggest thing that brings in all the money. So that's one thing I just that doesn't fluctuate.
You know, that's just like we know we're gonna get this amount of money every time kind of thing. Do you run six week sessions? The what? You run six, eight week sessions? It is a total of eight weeks. There is like the five weeks.
weeks but you know everyone's actually physically playing eight weeks on that. do, so yeah, so do know our league fees would be at the top, second right under that which I know it's not that far much further under it is would be our bar sales. You we do definitely do a lot on the bar. I would say I would layer it as league fees, bar sales, kitchen sales, you know, because we do have a pretty, we have a very wide range of food offered on
on our menu. And then after that would be, you know, people running out of facility for, you know, like work events, birthday parties, different things, you know, that would be just the one that's, that's not always the consistent, that's just random stuff here and there as it kind of comes through. And it's one thing I've thought about trying to maybe reach out and go to and target a little bit would be more corporate size events and stuff like that. One that kind of change, for the one I kind of brought in a new, just the idea of like, this looks like this could be kind of
big would be Kroger. Kroger came in and they wanted to do an employee appreciation tournament. And they've, this is now going to be coming up on their third year in a row where they've come to us. And basically they, they come in and they use our facility from nine to five. Basically they come in, we're sure the hours were really aren't open. You know, we don't open for leagues until six 20. So from nine to five, they come in and they just, I run all, I run everybody through it.
Mark Burik (37:22.382)
20, 25 teams of sixes on a Tuesday, 25 teams of sixes on a Wednesday and then Thursday. And then they take the top two teams from each of those days and then come in the following week and then do a big playoff tournament. And it's pretty, mean, it's big, women's crudder. So they put on a big show and they do a pretty big thing with it. And that's kind of, you know, one of those things that could be kind of a pretty neat to reach out and find those bigger, you know, Procter and Gamble or Ecolab, you know, just Walmart. mean, anybody really that's like big and just say, Hey,
This is like a setup that they did. This is how we can do it for you. Would you guys want to come in and do this? then, know, it's basically, it's just team bonding for them. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think the corporations that are willing to spend the big ones, big companies, like going to small companies when you've got seven courts or 14 courts to fill, that's a little bit tougher. But I know that Corey Seeger from Whitesand and Seeger Sandbar, they've done this several times now where they hired some up and coming.
DJs and musical artists, and they made their place into a concert venue for a day and a night. And they set up different stages for that. it's tens of thousands of dollars in one day. I think, I'm not sure if I'm right, but I think he was saying he was bringing in six figures for a one day event when you bring in the right DJ. And like for that DJ,
You already have to pay 10 to 20,000 depending on how successful they are. But running a, I always think it's cool. I, when I was in college, we had one frat house, I think, and they covered their basement in sand and they called it a luau. And I, you know, they probably ruined the house for whoever, but it was so sweet. And the idea of, you know, you're in Ohio and we're going to a luau type concert or.
rave or whatever, I've, I've always thought that that would be one of the major things that could serve as pops. like little revenue pops, if you can do it once a quarter or something like that. And if you do that, Ryan, you turn it into some type of big event venue plus volleyball. Of course, now you're running, that's a totally different business. So either need another employee or another four employees to be able to.
Mark Burik (39:44.14)
to handle the marketing sales, fulfillment, everything like that. I take my vacation that week. That'll be the week I take my vacation. guess I'm running this or it'll be when I just come in for the concert myself. But I mean, that would be, mean, that's what the planning ends in Columbus, Ohio. that was a place where Corey Robertson and his chaos beach volleyball. it was like his, the venue that he worked. He was like 14 outdoor courts. I'm going to say.
That's what they had there. had a really big building that had pool tables and then the stage for a band and stuff, real big bar and everything. But they would bring in some big name DJs. think Alessa was one that I personally was there for in Seoul. I'm pretty sure like Steve Dokey, if I'm not mistaken, that has been there. And they do a lot of country concerts, but they go through and they just take down all of the nets and posts off of everything and just make it a big open area and just let everybody in.
shoulder to shoulder, you know, across there with people. And they even had a swim up bar that they put in there and they ended up just filling in and the pool completely and just got rid of the swim up bar just because they wanted more space for people to be able to just get in for the concert, know, like, to be able to stay in at different things, you know, because that was, they were just making so much money off of those. So I do agree that that could be a big bonus space. We have had some people kind of reach out and ask them about doing something like that.
it just, it wasn't, know, the right kind of like vibes from who these people were and stuff, but also just cause our layout isn't, I mean, that kind of goes back to like the parking issue. I mean, we just don't have that extra access to bring that many people up or something like that. team up with somebody who might be able to run a shuttle thing if they have a big parking lot or something. Yeah, no, for sure. Is there anything that surprised you in terms of revenue creation?
difficulty or what brought in money or what lost money when you started becoming a manager of the facility. So something that you could warn other people who are starting along their journey of building a place in there, like, Hey, this didn't work out for us. I don't know why, or this surprisingly crushed it. thankfully I.
Mark Burik (42:08.12)
can't really think of anything that we tried to do where it was like, well, know, just try to move on kind of thing. Cause everything, I guess I was a little bit more fortunate in the fact that it was already a successful business when I came in. So there was already lots of things ironed out. And plus Kevin was always, is always still around to kind of just be my mentor and help on anything. So if there's something I question on, something I hadn't done before.
You know, I just I used check with him. There were I mean, there's been a lot of learning curves for me personally. I use YouTube a lot to figure out how to fix things or whatever, you know, stuff. So yeah, or something breaks or I need another something. I take a picture of it, do my search on what that image is to see where I can even buy it from and things like that. So it's definitely been a
It's just a learning curve for me and just to be able to just do all of that. the, I would say that, really about the only thing I could say, just, I, I don't like about it is that, is like the, it's just, there's really not like a clock out period for like me. know, and stuff's like, there's, just, cause I'm, you know, I'm the general manager, you know, as I have to run. So if something happens, if a referee doesn't show up,
last night, you know, then it's just like, right, well, I'm not planning a night, you know, and I gotta go up there and just do it, you know, and stuff like that. I get done with that. I'm getting started on my work. was gonna do for the evening, know, midnight or whatever. So it's, you know, so that's just the one thing is just is maybe trying to find certain steps or different things in there to be able to like, hey, you know, these are the processes or things that if something goes wrong, this is you contact this you have that kind of thing, rather than it's just kind of, you know,
filters into me to figure out kind of thing. So that would be honest, guess the one where I didn't realize how much time and coordination on different things, you know, there was to do. I mean, it is, it is a lot across the board, but. For two, I know a lot of facility owners are like, it's, you know, we want to do it because we want to promote and push volleyball at that level, but we also have to survive.
Mark Burik (44:30.77)
as a business, but do you find that two tournaments are great, but you, you just do it for the love of the future game, versus the fours and sixes because every owner I talked to is going, Hey, it's fours and sixes and we fit twos in when we can, but that's the pickiest players, the least revenue. And you know, it's not like a party social until the very end because people are so focused on winning when they're
being competitive. did you find that or do feel that? Yeah, I do know our bartenders don't like the two's tournaments. Or they were hopeful people who are big drinkers lose early because they have something to do kind of thing. I mean, that definitely is a thing. I think it's a little tougher for us because there are multiple locations within a 30 minute drive, two to three locations within a 30 minute drive of us.
So the options that work for you, people can go to play. There are options. So it's one thing I think if there really wasn't, if we were in the only place within an hour, two hour drive or something, then I could see like, well, we're gonna be the only ones holding a Sixes tournament, only one's holding a Quads tournament. But because other places are doing that, we do have to have a variety. even though doubles isn't the biggest money generator, you know.
for sure we still will have it on our set schedule every month, kind like no matter what, know, and everyone, know, because everyone knows that's where, you know, that's where it's come to play, you know, for that, you know, because we also, you know, because we don't, it was just kind of just thin out everything. We try to do nothing but like, watch tournaments every weekend all the way through. People still like to go play at other places and stuff like that. So, you know, they would just kind of get almost in a sense, burn out from it, you know, and they would, you know, take a break from us to go someplace else.
and then maybe they get help here for a little while, because they've just been doing it so much at our facility. So we have a pretty good rotation of high-level doubles, open-level doubles, or amateur-level doubles. And then we'll have some pretty competitive quads. We'll have some fundraiser quads, which are ministerial roles, but it's much more laid-back kind of thing. So for us, we have to have just that variety of things to kind of just keep things just different and changing for people. Cool.
Mark Burik (46:52.43)
All right, thank you so much for being a guest. One thing I do want to mention is that we've now got a little partnership teamwork type thing with Grand Sands Volleyball and we're going to be in Loveland, Ohio running one mini camp every month. So that'll be level and gender dependent. And so we will be frequenting that. And I know Logan Weber is going to be one of the main coaches who keeps coming back home because he kind of grew up in volleyball and that.
facility as well. And he loves it there. But if you guys are wanting to check it out and you want to check out a big long-term successful facility, whether you want to go there and play, take part in our camps, go to a tournament, or just kind of see what the facility looks like and what they've done with their building and their setup outside, take a visit to Grand Sands and then say hi to John Drake. And John, I'm wondering if anybody has any facility or
volleyball questions, if there's a good place for them to reach out and maybe ask you a question or maybe set up a site visit. Yeah, no, for sure. and I mean, I literally have my phone number on my phone numbers is a blasted on our website during like that. So it's not hidden or anything. So if you have a pen and paper, like really just jot down my phone number. It's five one three three three two eight six six two. And, I guess I just shoot me texts. I believe that best way to get ahold of me. I always reply when I can.
And I do know this was the first part of everything. And I actually am heading to Grand Sands right now to just kind of get ready for the evening and everything. So I won't be going for the rest of it. But I really appreciate everything and being able to talk a little bit. And again, looking forward to having you guys back out really next year. for your wisdom. And thanks for always being just so cool, down to Earth, easy to work with. Yeah, it's been a pleasure knowing you for all these years.
all the different capacities that we know each other and work with each other. So thanks for hopping on. Appreciate it from our guests. They appreciate it. yeah, guys, if you want to hear from John, go ahead and click rewind, write down his personal phone number, is awesome dude that he is. And that's it. So I'm here at Better at Beach. Thanks for listening. Hope you enjoyed the episode.
Mark Burik (49:14.583)
And if you want to be here for the live Q and A's and the weekly meetings where we do this live as well as our coaching meetings, just join the complete coach Academy head to better at each.com forward slash coach, or just come to one of our camps in Loveland, Ohio or wherever else we are. Awesome. Hey, Absolutely. Yes. We'll see you on the sand.
